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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 6:00 pm 
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=========================================================================

Since we've all agreed to our roles, I'm going to go ahead and start a thread of our own to start discussing scheduling, and any other things unique to our questing or RP, without taking up additional space in the already-massive Main Discussion Thread.

This thread is for the characters K1-K5, as well as any other Night Elf or Draenei "part-time" or "peripheral" characters who are along for the ride and the RP.

Some discussion points to start with:

*Should the NE level up on Azuremyst, or should we Draenei go to Teldrassil? Or should we start out separate and then meet up at a certain level? (I would rather the NE find a reason to go to Azuremyst for training - those zones are just better overall, I think, and I'd hate to wait til level 10-15 to start the RP).

*What tradeskills is everyone going to take? Let's strive for a balance. (Here is the one place where I am going to be extremely stubborn. Me want Jewelcrafter. Must have. Must must must. Even if we end up with 5 jewelcrafters, durnit! I'll explain why if people are really bugged by it, but otherwise, please just pick something other than jewelcrafter, and I will be your best friend 4evar.)

*Do the Draenei agree with my comments in the discussion thread about our background and how it will tie into the others'?

*Let's make sure, for RP variety, we have a male and female of each race. Who's willing to play what? (I had planned on a male.)

*What weeknight and what time do we want to play? (Tuesday or Wednesday are best for me, any time, but I'm probably the most open of any of us. I can make anything work except that if it ends up being Monday nights 7-10 EST I may end up missing a lot of weeks.)

*How serious are we going to be about PvP? (I would be happiest going into battlegrounds only during holiday weekends, and in as large a group as possible, but I'm open to doing more if I get good at it).

*Is our RP going to be mostly dramatic, mostly humorous, or some combination of the above? Also, how much inter-character conflict are you comfortable with? (I prefer a balance of humor and drama, and would like any inter-character conflict to be mostly under-the-surface and resolved within a few weeks.)

Please be as specific as possible in your answers!

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 6:35 pm 
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My answer to each question, in order... Edit: Oops, forgot a question!!

1. I really, really hate Azuremyst. Sorry, but I do. So much. Bloodmyst is ten times worse (my eyes can’t tolerate the red haze), and I’ve never seriously played a draenei because of it, having always given up after reaching Blood Watch. If you want to level in those places as opposed to Teldrassil, however, I can suck it up, because I’ll have an entire group and lots of roleplay to hopefully keep me happy. If you would prefer to address my concerns, a compromise would be questing in Azuremyst and then Darkshore.

2. Think I’ll get back to this when my priestess has a personality. That’s generally how I choose.

3. There isn’t really any agreement or disagreement on my end. You told us how we could be orphans despite our races’ lifespans, and it was plausible, which is all that can be asked for. My draenei’s personal history and situation will depend on what I come up with, but your comments were enough to help me understand what to do and work it out on my own (and it will probably end up similar).

4. I always play females, and I’ve mentioned that before, so there isn’t really a lot of flexibility there. I struggle with male characters and I don’t want to play one because of that (it could ruin my enjoyment of this).

5. Let’s see... Tuesdays at 7-10 PM EST sound great for me. I don’t want to do Mondays if that’s going to make you miss a lot of days, and my friends fancy running our D&D games sometime Wednesday through Saturday, always at 8. The 7-10 PM timeframe gives me time to recuperate after a strenuous school day (ugh, so much walking) without staying up horrifically late (my mother would kill me, and probably you too, Mishell).

6. I don’t really have an opinion. I picture my character as very much hating the orcs, so a lot of PvP would be in-character for her; however, I personally don’t like it. So if we do less, I’m happy with that. If we do more, that’s character-appropriate, so I’m happy with that too (and maybe I can improve my skills).

7. I like a roleplay that is realistic, in that it is not overly dramatic or overly humorous. It’s an average situation, with overtones of drama and some funny-man characters and lines to add the humor part. For inter-character conflict, I don’t mind it as much as long as it isn’t exhaustive: they’re always bickering, loudly, getting everyone involved. Constantly at each others’ throats. My favorite type of conflict is tense but subtle: it’s there, but it isn’t obvious and it isn’t violent. I don’t care when it’s resolved, as long as it takes a realistic amount of time (no getting over lifelong, obsessive hatreds in three weeks’ time, please).

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Last edited by Mythiene on Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:03 pm 
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My answers:
1. Should the NE level up on Azuremyst, or should we Draenei go to Teldrassil? I am absolutely fine with either. I think it makes slightly more sense for the NE to head to the Draenei areas, they're much more like like to go "ohh what was that big fire ball anyway?" However, we're also going to need to figure out time frames for the Exodar landing and current time.

2. What tradeskills is everyone going to take? I think I would be happiest NOT taking a tradeskill. I can grab herbalism/skinning or mining/skinning and provide a bunch of mats to others. Skinning is kind of a must cause it kills me to leave cash on the ground when mowing through beasts.

3. Do the Draenei agree with my comments in the discussion thread about our background and how it will tie into the others'? No opinion, I'm a night elf.

4. Let's make sure, for RP variety, we have a male and female of each race. Who's willing to play what? I can do either, but prefer female. I'll hold off on a decision until we know what the other two want to do and will go from there.

5. What weeknight and what time do we want to play? Tuesday nights 7-10 EST should be fine.

6. How serious are we going to be about PvP? I'll go when others are and see if I can get over my current dislike. Worse comes to worse, after the first month or so, if I haven't come to terms with it, I can bow out when you all head in.

7.a. Is our RP going to be mostly dramatic, mostly humorous, or some combination of the above? I like a mix, though a low key on all of the above. Not real interested in a comedy troupe, or a gothic melodrama.

7.b. Also, how much inter-character conflict are you comfortable with? I like a balance of humor and drama too, and would prefer any inter-character conflict to be generally resolved quickly. Ongoing strife for the sake of strife and the drama it creates can get exhausting after a while.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:29 pm 
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Spoiler:
THE ANSWERS!


*Should the NE level up on Azuremyst, or should we Draenei go to Teldrassil? I've never been the biggest fan of Teldrassil, and its been awhile since I've coasted through the Draenei starting areas. Back when I went through Bloodmyst I really liked the quests, especially upon receiving the Hand of Argus tabard and really immersing oneself in the plight of these refugees. Again though, I'm really open to either, whatever is preferred.

*What tradeskills is everyone going to take? Let's strive for a balance. I was thinking the engineer route, since as a Draenei on the ship, it seemed necessary for there to be a mechanical type of advancement. I could really be influenced though otherwise, it just doesn't really make sense for a Warrior to be making mana potions. And blacksmithing can get really expensive, especially at the upper echelons. I'm down for blacksmith though if we need it. I am also considering herbalism and inscription since the healing spell from the herbalism leveling is so useful to a warrior. Although it may not be as needed with the roleplay group.

*Do the Draenei agree with my comments in the discussion thread about our background and how it will tie into the others'? It seemed well enough for me. I hadn't really imagined him as a Draenor born guy, I thought of him as a little bit more wizened. But that should be workable for me. The one point I would want to bring up is the relationship the Draenei's enemy would have with the Night Elves. Remember that the Draenei were against Guldan and Nerzhul's fel orcs, which would've been a red color, as they were infused with Manny's blood. In the same manner, remember Hellscream's confrontation against Cenarius in the boroughs of Ashenvale. In both conflicts, they fought against red-blooded orcs. This means that both would have experienced the war against a seperate breed of orcs, bred from a different leader. Perhaps this could put them at odds against the other groups since they recognize the true threat is not these green-skinned Thrall's Horde, but rather their former leaders in the Burning Legion.

*Let's make sure, for RP variety, we have a male and female of each race. I was definately being a little masculine central in imagining that the warrior was going to be a big burly man. I imagined him as that Draenei warrior with the huge energy sword. I just can't really imagine the main tank as anything else. I admit that it is a bit male-centric and old-minded, but I just thought it would be that typical thing. Plus we seem to need another male.

*What weeknight and what time do we want to play? As I've said, I'm a college student, so the evenings would probably serve the best for me. I'm EST, so I'll say that any evening works, but preferrably not Friday or through the weekend. That being said, maybe Tuesday would be better since homework may be turned in later in the week. But I'm not one hundred sure yet.

*How serious are we going to be about PvP? As the tank, I feel that I've got a big role into the PVP, and I imagined him RP wise as the protector, who would fight across enemy lines to protect those in his orphaned 'family.'

*Is our RP going to be mostly dramatic, mostly humorous, or some combination of the above? I definately at least imagined my role as being a little more dramatic. I think he would be that soldier archetype, who took everything seriously and who was only focused at the mission at hand. Bred for war, I think it would be one of those things where people were trying to break him down but it was very hard for him.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:42 pm 
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Not being a member of the K-Group, I hope folks will pardon my chipping in my two coppers, regardless.

I just wanted to point out that the most exciting quests in Bloodmyst, the ones that wrap up the whole storyline and make you a hero, are draenei-only. Sure, anyone can tag along with someone doing the quests, but your characters won't get the XP and can't even get any dialogue or involvement unless they're sticking like glue to a draenei.

We ran the Owls through the Bloodmyst quests
Spoiler:
Hey, you get to kill an actual Eredar at level 20 --- how could a group of anti-demon fanatics resist?
, and it is doable, but you definitely need to do a lot of handwaving and planning on the part of the non-draenei.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:15 pm 
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*Should the NE level up on Azuremyst, or should we Draenei go to Teldrassil? I can do both in my sleep (I usually do both zones). I would rather do 1-5 in the respective starting zones (doesn't make much sense and can't do all the quests for NE to be at the crash site), 6-~10 on Azuremyst, and then rather than following the quest to Bloodmyst to become part of the Hand, we go to Darkshore (where I would need to do my Druid quest anyway).

*What tradeskills is everyone going to take? I hadn't decided yet, but it would be between Skinner/Leatherworker or Herbalist/Alchemist. Probably whichever would put me in the least amount of competition for gathering.

*Do the Draenei agree with my comments in the discussion thread about our background and how it will tie into the others'? As a night elf, I have no opinion (but it sounded reasonable).

*Let's make sure, for RP variety, we have a male and female of each race. Who's willing to play what? I had planned to make this character male.

*What weeknight and what time do we want to play? I'm a little concerned, because I see everyone saying Tuesday. However, that's one of the two nights that I absolutely can't play (the other being Thursday). Of Mishell's options, Wednesday would be the best (but can also do Monday, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday evenings). If that's a big problem, I may need to be assigned to another group or move to peripheral status.

*How serious are we going to be about PvP? As long as we're together, I can do as much or as little as we like, but if PVP is going to be a part of this, at least one match on the PVP night.

*Is our RP going to be mostly dramatic, mostly humorous, or some combination of the above? Also, how much inter-character conflict are you comfortable with? I prefer low key or dry humor as relief from external drama. I really can't tolerate much inter-character conflict. The Sha'ei demonstrated how much conflict a mixed draenei/night elf group could generate and, while interesting as a story, it's highly stressful (and not why I play WOW) and required some people to really bend their characters to justify the group continuing. So, if it can be resolved in 15 minutes, or doesn't create a situation where the reasonable response would be for one or more people to leave, I can tolerate it. So-and-so are always competing to see who's the better such-and-such, fine. Bob an George are both competing for Sophie's attention, fine. He thinks arcane magic is the source of all evil and the draenei are a hair's breadth away from eredar while she thinks night elves and their druidic magic are nothing but savages playing with clubs and argue about it all the time, not cool.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:19 pm 
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Finn's right.

We did the draenei main quest in Bloodmyst with the Sha'ei, and it's really wasn't fun for me from that perspective. It felt like we were just helping other people kill elites while they ran back and forth between NPCS, to me, as a NE.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 9:35 pm 
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*Should the NE level up on Azuremyst, or should we Draenei go to Teldrassil? Or should we start out separate and then meet up at a certain level? (I would rather the NE find a reason to go to Azuremyst for training - those zones are just better overall, I think, and I'd hate to wait til level 10-15 to start the RP).

I really have no preference. I'll go and do whatever everybody else feels is the best idea.

*What tradeskills is everyone going to take? Let's strive for a balance. (Here is the one place where I am going to be extremely stubborn. Me want Jewelcrafter. Must have. Must must must. Even if we end up with 5 jewelcrafters, durnit! I'll explain why if people are really bugged by it, but otherwise, please just pick something other than jewelcrafter, and I will be your best friend 4evar.)

Once again, I can take what's needed. I haven't decided on what kind of character I'm playing, if I'm playing at all. So anything is open.

*Do the Draenei agree with my comments in the discussion thread about our background and how it will tie into the others'?

Sure. Gotta love a one-word answer.

*Let's make sure, for RP variety, we have a male and female of each race. Who's willing to play what?

Like I said, anybody. I was planning male, too. Just for the experience. But I'll roll female if it fits better.

*What weeknight and what time do we want to play?

I'm free all day mondays, and I can free any decided weeknight. I'll simply do my homework another night. All weekends are free.

*How serious are we going to be about PvP?

Don't care. I'm not that great about PvP but anybody can be taught, I guess.

*Is our RP going to be mostly dramatic, mostly humorous, or some combination of the above? Also, how much inter-character conflict are you comfortable with?

I like two levels of conflict: one immediate, resolved in a week at the most severe, and long-standing. long-standing involves skepticism, grudges, etc. In other words, differences between the characters that have to be overcome and are fodder for character development.

Outside forces can develop a character, but so can inside ones.

As for humor: go. Humor's a real need to keep the whole thing from becoming a whinefest. Dramatic plots are dramatic. But open up a sideplot that involves covering up something embarrassing... sure. Fun times.

I don't even know what class or race I'm playing yet. I'm a little lost: I haven't been on all day. Where should I go to look?

(I'm not this much of a ditz usually-- I've just been running around all day...)


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:12 pm 
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Aster: While I greatly appreciate your quick and thorough response, I think you should double-check the main info thread - my understanding was that you were interested in the gnome mage slot? So that's what I gave ya. :)

Not that you can't make an NE or Draenei alt and come play with us if you have time for both!

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:20 pm 
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Tallador wrote:
The one point I would want to bring up is the relationship the Draenei's enemy would have with the Night Elves. Remember that the Draenei were against Guldan and Nerzhul's fel orcs, which would've been a red color, as they were infused with Manny's blood. In the same manner, remember Hellscream's confrontation against Cenarius in the boroughs of Ashenvale. In both conflicts, they fought against red-blooded orcs.


Actually, you're only half right. Defnitely check out Christie Golden's Rise of the Horde if you have not. It clarifies everything and I consider it a must-read for anyone who wants to deeply RP a Draenei. It's fabulous. But I'll summarize the skin color stuff here.

Orcs were originally BROWN. Like the untainted orcs in Outland, the Mag'har aren't they called? The green skin tone was a taint from drinking demon blood, and unfortunately it was permanent and passed on even to their untainted children. Those who drank AGAIN turned red.

Long story short, the orcs who slaughtered all the Draenei on Draenor were green, oh so very green. :twisted:

And the Night Elves fought both green AND red orcs in WC3. I imagine they're not a fan of orcs of any shade.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:22 pm 
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Another reason to avoid Tuesdays is that they're server maintenance (and patch) days. We were constantly needing to cancel the Sha'ei and Repercussions of Freedom was frequently bumped because of extended server maintenance.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:24 pm 
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Can we do Wednesdays?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 12:51 am 
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Mishell wrote:
Tallador wrote:
The one point I would want to bring up is the relationship the Draenei's enemy would have with the Night Elves. Remember that the Draenei were against Guldan and Nerzhul's fel orcs, which would've been a red color, as they were infused with Manny's blood. In the same manner, remember Hellscream's confrontation against Cenarius in the boroughs of Ashenvale. In both conflicts, they fought against red-blooded orcs.


Actually, you're only half right. Defnitely check out Christie Golden's Rise of the Horde if you have not. It clarifies everything and I consider it a must-read for anyone who wants to deeply RP a Draenei. It's fabulous. But I'll summarize the skin color stuff here.

Orcs were originally BROWN. Like the untainted orcs in Outland, the Mag'har aren't they called? The green skin tone was a taint from drinking demon blood, and unfortunately it was permanent and passed on even to their untainted children. Those who drank AGAIN turned red.

Long story short, the orcs who slaughtered all the Draenei on Draenor were green, oh so very green. :twisted:

And the Night Elves fought both green AND red orcs in WC3. I imagine they're not a fan of orcs of any shade.


That makes much more sense. I was just seeing a common connection between the understanding of the Draenei and Night Elven allies. I understood the transformation of the skin tone, but the only thing that confused me was that the Fel Orcs in Hellfire are red. Perhaps they drank the blood of Magtheridon too? The way I read it on WoWiki was that only by the continued exposure to the demonic blood left them red. This was one of the reasons why I felt that SOME of the orcs on Draenor would have been red. But I guess after having read through the article on the Fel Orcs that they drank Magtheridon's blood to gain that red coloring. It just seems silly that this wouldn't have already happened to at least some of the orcs.

It's really unnecessary though for me to debate this further! I think it would make the most sense to just assume that they were killed by some variation of the Orcs. Perhaps during the genocide their parents were killed but the child had been hidden and smuggled towards the Exodar? That would probably make the most sense. Reminds me though of stories of children smuggled across Germany as the Nazis swept through with the Blitzkreig and the beginning of the Holocaust.

To be honest, I don't think I'm realizing how terrifying this would have been. As for the Wed. time slot, like I said it may not be the best for me, but I won't really know for sure until I get the ball running for the year.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:33 am 
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Re: timeline -

When our characters boarded the Exodar, they would have been adults or within a year or two of being considered adults, because two years later is when our story starts, and our characters aer officially "of age."

As for when they were orphaned, the Draenei were wiped out sometime between 20 and 28 years ago. Draenei have a TREMENDOUSLY long lifespan, at least as long as the Night Elves, and Night Elves come of age at 200 years old, so chances are our Draenei characters were pretty old when their parents died as well. But we don't need to know the exact ages of our Draenei, because they don't seem to think in precise years anyhow. Probably they are considered "of age" when they reach certain physical milestones and/or pass some sort of test or initiation. I'm just guessing that since they don't seem to keep track of exact years.

This will match up with the experience of our other characters, who would have been orphaned as adolescents, not when they were babies.


Re: Wednesday time slot

Given that Jane and I can't do Mondays regularly, and that Blake's Tiger can't do Tuesdays or Thursdays ever, Wednesday night or Sunday night are our only "weeknight" options. Weekends are reserved for the guild-wise PvP stuff. I'd prefer Wednesday night to Sunday night, either of which I imagine will be equally bad for our college students.

I think the students will just have to perhaps plan ahead and make sure they have a couple of hours free Wednesday nights. From what I remember of college, unless you have a night class, that's easy to do if you discipline yourself. You'll probably have a Tues/Thurs. class, but there's nothing saying you can't do your homework for Thursday on Tuesday night, or Wednesday morning/afternoon. Etc. Of course there will be times when you have a HUGE paper due and need every last minute up to the Thursday deadline, and in those cases you're free to skip a meeting, of course! We'll all hafe to, now and then.

The main thing is, we don't want to put the meetings on a day when we KNOW that one or two of our members will have to skip more than half the time.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:48 am 
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Tallador wrote:
I understood the transformation of the skin tone, but the only thing that confused me was that the Fel Orcs in Hellfire are red. Perhaps they drank the blood of Magtheridon too? The way I read it on WoWiki was that only by the continued exposure to the demonic blood left them red.


It's really more simple than that, from what I've read. You're right that this doesn't need to be a lengthy debate, but also there's no reason for you to be confused. If you're an orc and you drink demon blood once, you turn green. Drink it twice, you turn red. :) Doesn't matter which demon, or when.

The Draenei were wiped out by orcs who had drunk demon blood once. This scene is depicted in Rise of the Horde and it was definitely a one-time thing. Those who drank turned green instantly. The green skin tone does become "contagious" thereafter, gradually corrupting those who are near the blood-drinkers, and it also passes on to the children. On its own, though, the spread of the corruption doesn't go any farther than to turn them green. A lot is made of the green skin tone in the book, which also covers the battle against the Draenei.

The fel orcs now on Outland have drunk demon blood again, as did the red ones in WC3. I highly recommend you find a copy of Rise of the Horde. It's just a darned entertaining book, if nothing else. :mrgreen:

A good general thing to remember: WoWWiki (while often a helpful starting place!) is not written by Blizzard, but by fans who, like us, don't necessarily know all the answers. I've caught them in more than one mistake, before. So if there is a place you can do your research that is directly from the horse's mouth, so to speak (WoW comics, novels, RPG books), you'll get a more accurate picture, generally.

We actually have a whole thread on how DP has agreed to prioritize lore sources when there are conflicts... And here it is! WowWiki did not end up on the list (this was written a long time ago) but if it were it'd be second to the bottom. And technically it doesn't need to be on there at all, since everything on WoWWiki is just cobbled together from the other sources in the list.

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